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jalyst is offline jalyst
2011-06-28 , 21:34
Moderator | Posts: 5,320 | Thanked: 4,464 times | Joined on Oct 2009
#1221
Originally Posted by Jaffa View Post
No, we're asking you to calm down and wait for a definitive answer
That's just what was so bizarre...
What was there to calm-down about, I wasn't getting worked up, LOL!

That's quite late given what we know of the N9's development.
Fair enough point, still far from a "smoking gun".

Nokia: yay! But no actual products or prototypes or statements from Nokia (according to Google) that they're actively working on the technology.
Another fair enough point, but again not a definitive answer.

Check. Certainly a 3.5mm headphone jack would meet those requirements.
OK, agnostic. But only micro-USB & HDMI connectors used to date. Hmm, doesn't bode well.
Let's also think about the circuitry then. Assuming MHL requires 5 pins (4 USB data + ground of a MicroUSB socket), the 3.5mm socket would need to be longer to also maintain compatibility with headsets and headphones. The switching circuitry would be complicated and the socket physically bigger. In a device where size has been optimised as much as possible.
You seem to be working on the assumption that it must be implemented as a switching mechanism between: MHL implemented via mUSB, & the 3.5mm port.
I imagine you assume that because there's already one "tv-out", so why would they bother w/a 2nd via mUSB.

That in itself is a pretty good reason...
Hence why we need to be certain it can't have been implemented the way you suggest.
But there's also the possibility that MHL can be implemented directly via 3.5mm AV, that has not yet been disproved.

Finally...
It's unlikely they've also implemented TV-out via mUSB, given TV-out's already implemented via AV 3.5mm.
But I don't see how we can discount the possibility that mUSB MHL cannot be enabled via hacking attempts later on.

I think we can all agree there needs to be more technical info released, before we can be 100% certain about any of these permutations.
Honestly not trolling... I hope you see that!?!
Last edited by jalyst; 2011-06-29 at 08:18.
 
madstunt is offline madstunt
2011-06-28 , 21:39
Posts: 29 | Thanked: 11 times | Joined on Dec 2010 @ Hungary, Szeged
#1222
I've just noticed that the N9 miss the BlueTooth HID profile, so there won't be any external bluetooth keyboard or mouse fun

I checked the specs at developer.nokia.com and nokia.com/n9
 
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Jaffa is offline Jaffa
2011-06-28 , 21:41
Posts: 2,535 | Thanked: 6,681 times | Joined on Mar 2008 @ UK
#1223
Originally Posted by jalyst View Post
I think we can all agree there needs to be more technical info released, before we can be 100% certain about any of these permutations.
Well, what evidence - at all - is there that there's any form of HD output? Urho Konttori says "there is no HDMI", the spec sheets don't mention it and only talk about "TV-out".

I think we can all agree there needs to be more technical info released, before we can be 100% certain the N9 won't allow you to travel back in time. Maybe it won't do it out of the box, but with a bit of hacking...

Honestly not trolling... I hope you see that!?!
I don't think you're trolling - I think you're just setting yourself up for disappointment (along with those who hoped PR1.3 would bring Flash 10.1)
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tswindell is offline tswindell
2011-06-28 , 21:48
Posts: 724 | Thanked: 1,255 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Cambridge, UK
#1224
Originally Posted by jalyst View Post
That's just what was so bizarre...
What was there calm-down about, I wasn't getting worked up, LOL!



Fair enough point, still far from a "smoking gun".



Another fair enough point, but again not a definitive answer.



You seem to be working on the assumption that it must be implemented as a switching mechanism between: MHL implemented via mUSB, & the 3.5mm port.
I imagine you assume that because there's already one "tv-out", so why would they bother w/a 2nd via mUSB.

That in itself is a pretty good reason...
Hence why we need to be certain it can't have been implemented the way you suggest.
But there's also the possibility that MHL can be implemented directly via 3.5mm AV, that has not yet been disproved.

Finally...
It's unlikely they've also implemented TV-out via mUSB, given TV-out's already implemented via AV 3.5mm.
But I don't see how we can discount the possibility that mUSB MHL cannot be enabled via hacking attempts later on.

I think we can all agree there needs to be more technical info released, before we can be 100% certain about any of these permutations.
Honestly not trolling... I hope you see that!?!
Seriously, drop it, there is no HD video output. Konttori said it himself: "N9 doesn't have HDMI."

http://konttoristhoughts.blogspot.co...73851680035486

Now please stop filling peoples heads with candy floss ideas that just aren't true and have no basis on reality in the slightest. I could say the N9 has actually got an IR emitter around the camera, but it doesn't, there is _no_ basis for that information, you've just made it up.
 

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jalyst is offline jalyst
2011-06-28 , 21:54
Moderator | Posts: 5,320 | Thanked: 4,464 times | Joined on Oct 2009
#1225
I've asked Konttori if he has time to weigh-in.

Originally Posted by Jaffa View Post
Well, what evidence - at all - is there that there's any form of HD output?
There isn't, that's why I'm asking the Qns I am!
There was no evidence for other features... until recently.

Urho Konttori says "there is no HDMI", the spec sheets don't mention it and only talk about "TV-out".
As I understand it, If MHL is implemented or do-able, it's irrelevant whether there's HDMI or not.
Well we've had plenty of examples so far where the specs sheets don't tell the full story.

I don't think you're trolling - I think you're just setting yourself up for disappointment (along with those who hoped PR1.3 would bring Flash 10.1)
Thank-you!
I'm getting it irrespective... my decision doesn't hinge around that.

Originally Posted by tswindell View Post
Now please stop filling peoples heads with candy floss ideas that just aren't true and have no basis on reality in the slightest. I could say the N9 has actually got an IR emitter around the camera, but it doesn't, there is _no_ basis for that information, you've just made it up.
Please... don't mischaracterise what I've been posting, totally uncalled for...
I haven't ever claimed that the feature's there, I've merely called for proof that it's not there or not do-able.
That proof certainly hasn't come from you, your responses have simply consisted of "shut up".
Last edited by jalyst; 2011-06-28 at 22:11.
 
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kevloral is offline kevloral
2011-06-28 , 22:15
Posts: 134 | Thanked: 247 times | Joined on Sep 2009 @ Spain, EU
#1226
Originally Posted by NvyUs View Post
haha someone made a game of elop burning platform and published it to Ovi store http://store.ovi.com/content/121617

game description is hilarious

Elop is a mischievous boy. He is on a platform and want let it burn! Please help (not him!) and shoot the water on the fire. You will only win, if you can drop Elpo from the platform. Are you a hero?
The game has been removed from Ovi. Shame on them.
 

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shallimus is offline shallimus
2011-06-28 , 22:16
Posts: 568 | Thanked: 969 times | Joined on Dec 2009 @ Toronto
#1227
Originally Posted by jalyst View Post
I haven't ever claimed that the feature's there, I've merely called for proof that it's not there or not do-able.
That proof certainly hasn't come from you, you responses have simply consisted of "shut up".
Umm... you're both right? Chances are we won't get HDMI out on the N9. It would be lovely to get it; it might be possible, and it hasn't been categorically disproven, but that alone doesn't mean it is possible.

Originally Posted by Wikipedia
One looks in the back seat of one's car and finds no adult-sized kangaroos and then uses this negative/null adult-sized kangaroo detection results in conjunction with the previously determined fact (or just plain old proposition) that adult-sized kangaroos, if present, cannot evade such detection, to deduce a new fact that there are indeed no adult-sized kangaroos present in the back seat of said car.
Substitute "reasons why we can't have HDMI-via-MHL-via-microUSB on the N9" for "adult kangaroos" and you're half way there
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dansus is offline dansus
2011-06-28 , 22:18
Posts: 279 | Thanked: 208 times | Joined on Aug 2009 @ London
#1228
Originally Posted by zwer View Post
I was thinking in a broad sense, not just the Media Player widget but other controlling widgets -
If your talking about the Android like control bar for toggling things like BT, WAN and WLAN, then how about when your on the notification pane, the user can swipe down to reveal an icon bar to toggle, with last one being a link to settings.

I wouldnt do it the way Android works, where your finger has to accurately hit the status bar at the top and sometimes finding yourself having multiple goes at trying to active the function.
 
tswindell is offline tswindell
2011-06-28 , 22:22
Posts: 724 | Thanked: 1,255 times | Joined on Nov 2007 @ Cambridge, UK
#1229
So when a lead developer in the N9 says no HDMI, that isn't proof enough for you? ...
 
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shallimus is offline shallimus
2011-06-28 , 22:37
Posts: 568 | Thanked: 969 times | Joined on Dec 2009 @ Toronto
#1230
Originally Posted by tswindell View Post
So when a lead developer in the N9 says no HDMI, that isn't proof enough for you? ...
Heh.

Yeah, prettymuch. I think the various people involved all agree that:
  1. sources saying "No HDMI ever" outweigh sources saying "HDMI possibly"
  2. HDMI would be great
  3. Konttori said it's not happening

What's left over is just arguing about logic, really.

I'm going to leave it at that, unless/until [Announce] MHL microUSB hack for N9 sometime in early 2012
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