You know what, how about you go and sit in #meego-arm in irc.freenode.net for a week and just watch all the work that's actually getting poured into this system on N900?

Sign up for meego-commits mailing list to see what's being pushed into the MeeGo system in general. Check daily test reports.

Until you've actually looked at the damn work being done, shut the f*** up about 'no action'

So... you want to take it personal, you asked for it...

How about you prove me the **** wrong buddy. Mer? Mer^2? This soon to be aborted approximation of a dead end?

Prove me wrong. I ****ing dare you.

I'm not in charge of MeeGo nor am I here to defend whatever Nokia does with their differentiation. Their choice. I'm working on MeeGo for N900 and I take offense by your statements that nothing is being done. As I've said before, this is nothing like Mer - a boatload of employees are paid to work on this, proper program management, release engineering, professionals, the works.

If you want to look at what work is being done:

http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-commits/

http://wiki.meego.com/images/MeeGo_C...ugust_2010.pdf

http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-releases/

http://trac.tspre.org/merbot/freenode/%23meego-arm/

http://wiki.meego.com/Quality/HandsetTestReport

If that's 'no action' then what is 'action'?

Action is a finished product. Do not ever forget that in this regard, most will default to being a consumer first.

Any other personal insults you wish to sling my way? Or do you wish to list to lists, conversations, links that... well, show a lot of work, but ultimately supports what I said earlier... shows a lot of talking.

I know what you're doing is not a simple task; however after 3 years, even my patience has been worn down to nigh zero.

Conversations? Go look at the bloody statistics and commit messages (relating directly to work being done and included in the OS).

Action is a finished product agreed, but action is -also- the progress to get to there. You think Mobile OS'es get magically born in the sky and ready at birth?

Mobile OS'es are like sausages - you really don't want to see how they're done. And with MeeGo, you actually get to. With the broken images and releases, problems along the way. etc.

If you only care about final product, sign up for a releases list and until then, keep quiet - we're on a fixed release schedule, so no complaining about delays. Or learn to understand this is a product development phase and respect other people's work to make it a product and that it will look very ugly during the process.

Care to answer one question. Can I install it and maintain the same level of functionality as I enjoy today?

No. MeeGo (.com) isn't a consumer-oriented product - it can't include MP3 codecs for legal reasons, too (just like Ubuntu). It might be installable, but not in there out of the box. This pretty much makes it unusable for Joe User (or gerbick?).

That said, like Ubuntu, it can be made usable. But that is an effort on top of MeeGo.com (feel free to roll your own distro or send patches to easily integrate those things)

Vendors, such as Nokia, take MeeGo, put differentiation on top (closed applications, themes, icons, app stores).

As a consumer, you'll want a Nokia-differentiated MeeGo.com-based system.

Is it possible to eventually port whatever Nokia-differentiation MeeGo.com-based system to N900 eventually? - on a strictly technical basis?

Two things here:

* Nokia-differentiation MeeGo.com-based system does not exist yet. We have Harmattan, which is Debian-based. We can't port what doesn't exist.

* Any differentiation on top of MeeGo.com would be in terms of codecs, applications, plugins, app stores.

This means that it is very likely that if a Nokia-differentiation MeeGo.com-based system existed, it would run on N900 by simply adding in the packages.

And last of all:

It isn't my job to give you this.

There's still a fair play agreement regarding Nokia binaries on Nokia devices in place and whoever wants to do the job is welcome to do it when there is a Nokia-differentiation MeeGo.com-based system. It'll probably be a matter of recompiling source packages (if even needed) and adding them to a MIC2 kickstart file.

My job is (together with the rest of the team) to make MeeGo for N900 hardware adaptation great and stable - a technical job.

This means that the reference dialer must be able to make actual phonecalls and receive them. That the reference video player will play Theora videos. That the browser (Fennec) will work over 3G and WiFi. That you can send and receive SMS'es. That battery charging works. That the kernel patches are maintained and upstreamed and kernel kept in shape. That both cameras can be accessed and used. That I can listen to oggs in a reference media player.

And many more things.

As Stskeeps, the consumer:

I don't personally understand why people are so hung up on Nokia's closed source apps, I mean, they're not the greatest.

I hope MeeGo changes the landscape and it is possible to download from Adobe 'Flash Player for MeeGo Handset ARMv7'. But all of those things are out of my hands but I'm seeing impressive change when it comes to many closed source bits and licensing/redistributability and I can only hope it continues.

Then as a consumer, I will stand by my original stance whether you like it or not. Until that answer above changes in a manner that convinces me that it is a "Yes", then I may be as I were earlier - hopeful, yet able to point to nothing that's completed as of yet.

If you still somehow take offense to that, refer back to my first response to you.

As a developer, that's a total different subject. However - and I'm going to add a new perspective - as a businessman, I depend upon my phone and the ability to answer it to make my payroll. Not to compile, not to hit up a website we've developed in Adobe Flex via AS3 and requires Adobe Flash Player 10.x.x.x - and as it stands, I'm looking at a lot of fail there too.

Not usable for Joe User? Not usable to gerbick? Not usable unless you've been employed by Nokia it sounds like.

Or not usable if you're actually a person that uses the N900 as a phone.

No, we're on the same page now - as long as we both keep this discussion in mind when discussing MeeGo for N900.

I'm still reeling from the prior attack. It made absolutely no sense; still doesn't. However, as it stands, I stand by how I was corrected earlier... and the confusion is not only mine about which build, which OS, which direction support will come from the (official) MeeGo vs. MeeGo (community) vs. MeeGo-Harmattan (if that's different from the prior option, hell if I know)... I'm not the only person that's confused a bit.

Nor am I the only person that wants updates to the next level of something either. And guess what? I'm probably going to be even more vocal because I'm an N900 owner now.