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szopin is offline szopin
2012-04-21 , 08:27
Posts: 2,076 | Thanked: 3,268 times | Joined on Feb 2011
#251
Not all Nokia IP has been handed over. For a test someone might upload Maemo image for flashing on android device and we will see who will send a cease and desist letter, Nokia or the troll (or MS???). For Google there is a lot to get. Quadcores burn a lot of energy, so if that is needed for smooth working of their system they have a battery-tech block (or 6h uptime devices, try to market those), so either reinvent Android (maemo IP would come very handy here) or go Apple way: we can run one app smooth at a time - multitasking is for geeks.
Would council be able to get into an agreement with Nokia that the community has preference (even over price as the opensource idea is worth more than money, of course to some limits) when it gets to selling maemo parts? Can we get the first offer, before big corpos that will buy it to kill it? I'd vote for someone interested in that direction of community-Nokia talks
 

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misterc is offline misterc
2012-04-21 , 08:38
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#252
Originally Posted by szopin View Post
Not all Nokia IP has been handed over. For a test someone might upload Maemo image for flashing on android device and we will see who will send a cease and desist letter, Nokia or the troll (or MS???). For Google there is a lot to get. Quadcores burn a lot of energy, so if that is needed for smooth working of their system they have a battery-tech block (or 6h uptime devices, try to market those), so either reinvent Android (maemo IP would come very handy here) or go Apple way: we can run one app smooth at a time - multitasking is for geeks.
Would council be able to get into an agreement with Nokia that the community has preference (even over price as the opensource idea is worth more than money, of course to some limits) when it gets to selling maemo parts? Can we get the first offer, before big corpos that will buy it to kill it? I'd vote for someone interested in that direction of community-Nokia talks
Google bought Motorola mobile.
they have money to burn, but... that much money?
who else cares about open source?
who?
Novell?
Red Hat?
the buntu crap company?
BIG (i mean, BIG) techno companies like IBM or Oracle invest in open source, but even then, it is only to better sell their actual products, not for the sake of FOSS...
same thing for Maemo, isn't it?

EDIT: my take on this is that some Chinese company would buy the brand, the factories & whatever IP is left and... bye bye Maemo
pretty much what happend with Rover (the car company; & it wasn't for the lack of big (car) companies (Honda, BMW) trying to save it; consumers simply had lost their faith in the brand even though Rover was once a leading edge company (Land / Range Rover))
i doubt however that Maemo is enough of a commercial success to hope for that...
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Last edited by misterc; 2012-04-21 at 08:46. Reason: my take...
 
timoph is offline timoph
2012-04-21 , 08:45
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#253
I thought this was a thread about "council election" but evidently it's another issue of "doomsday is upon us". please read the logs from the last council meeting (I posted a link to them in the ask the council thread) for the current response to the "hand the IP over" demand. Summary: not all IP in the FW images are Nokia's (read that as 'not going to happen') and what is isn't that likely to be handed over especially using vague requests.
 

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szopin is offline szopin
2012-04-21 , 08:52
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#254
Originally Posted by timoph View Post
I thought this was a thread about "council election" but evidently it's another issue of "doomsday is upon us". please read the logs from the last council meeting (I posted a link to them in the ask the council thread) for the current response to the "hand the IP over" demand. Summary: not all IP in the FW images are Nokia's (read that as 'not going to happen') and what is isn't that likely to be handed over especially using vague requests.
Council election is going to rely on candidate's pov on IP debate (sure, scare-tactics, but it seems like the last council that will have a chance to change something, add to that 'in-transition' point in Nokia evolution, best point to demand/make changes), views on Kickstarter campaigns or such (skipping the white-knight "FOSS will make you end up in heaven" argument and down to business negotiations instead) by the council actually do mean something for me in the upcoming election. If this is off-topic pls delete my posts from this thread. I would love to hear what candidates plan, or just want the title to their scout-medals collection (beauty contest trophees whatever)
Last edited by szopin; 2012-04-21 at 08:54.
 

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2012-04-21 , 08:54
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#255
Originally Posted by timoph View Post
I thought this was a thread about "council election" but evidently it's another issue of "doomsday is upon us". please read the logs from the last council meeting (I posted a link to them in the ask the council thread) for the current response to the "hand the IP over" demand. Summary: not all IP in the FW images are Nokia's (read that as 'not going to happen') and what is isn't that likely to be handed over especially using vague requests.
Originally Posted by woody14619 View Post
[...]

One of the many dangers of banning people [ignoring ideas]: If you screw up and ban [ignore] someone by accident, or [...] because they expressed a common view, you wind up ignorant of reality. Hiding your view of the crazies of this world for short periods of time can [be] good for one's sanity. Doing so perpetually leads toward a myopic, delusional, skewed view of things in the long term.

[...]
does the Council operate in a vacuum?
what are candidates ideas about this?
or is this "too fare away" to be worthy the Council's (candidates) attention?

afraid of answers?
so far, the only one who stepped on the floor is Woody; again, he gets my vote
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timoph is offline timoph
2012-04-21 , 09:11
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#256
Originally Posted by szopin View Post
Council election is going to rely on candidate's pov on IP debate (sure, scare-tactics, but it seems like the last council that will have a chance to change something), views on Kickstarter campaigns or such (skipping the white-knight "FOSS will make you end up in heaven" argument and down to business negotiations instead) by the council actually do mean something for me in the upcoming election. If this is off-topic pls delete my posts from this thread. I would love to hear what candidates plan, or just want the title to their scout-medals collection (beauty contest trophees whatever)
Not for all it isn't. Personally I don't care about that side of the story that much. Actually I will most likely not vote for a candidate that seems to be running for the council just to be able to shout to Nokia to hand over it's IP and painting doomsday scenarios. I'd like to see constructive doers that do not get their head stuck on these doomsday scenarios.

btw, why are candidates' views on kickstarter programs, etc. important? I don't see how that has any effect on the council's work. Also did you read the logs (they are quite long but worth the read)

edit: @misterc I didn't get what you are saying so don't know what to answer you
Last edited by timoph; 2012-04-21 at 09:16.
 

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szopin is offline szopin
2012-04-21 , 09:19
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#257
Originally Posted by timoph View Post
Not for all it isn't. Personally I don't care about that side of the story that much. Actually I will most likely not vote for a candidate that seems to be running for the council just to be able to shout to Nokia to hand over it's IP and painting doomsday scenarios. I'd like to see constructive doers that do not get their head stuck on these doomsday scenarios.

btw, why are candidates' views on kickstarter programs, etc. important? I don't see how that has any effect on the council's work. Also did you read the logs (they are quite long but worth the read)
Not yet.

From my perspective (before reading the logs, will stuff those words in my mouth if something gamechanging is included there, sorry in advance) all maemo community did was asking/hoping/begging a company, corporate entity that is not interested in moral ideas of freedom/opensource. What we lacked was monetary argument (any corpo argument really). Negotiations with Nokia if we proposed to them: instead of killing maemo/harmattan offer a price for that team, work, code, we will raise funds; instead of: pls Nokia you said you love FOSS, why you not releasing??? (insert angry rant when no reply is given) - would be much more frutiful (hopefully of course). We need negotiators as speakers for the community, not people endorsing this or other community project. This community deserves better future. And understanding what is needed to achieve the goal (open source Fremantle/Harmattan in my opinion is THE goal), not sending email reminders/followups to people who ignore you every two weeks to put an X on todo list next to 'Try to open source maemo'

EDIT: reading through the logs, just a disclaimer: SD69 I have nothing against you (especially seeing you alone as the council, kudos), my rambling is about community-mentality not finding same language with corporation in general. We need people with marketing/PR experience (maybe even sales, we need to sale/buy this idea). As much as I love programmists, they do not make the best persons for selling an idea to people (or company)
Last edited by szopin; 2012-04-21 at 09:35.
 

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timoph is offline timoph
2012-04-21 , 09:48
Posts: 415 | Thanked: 732 times | Joined on Jan 2009 @ Finland
#258
Originally Posted by szopin View Post
Not yet.

From my perspective (before reading the logs, will stuff those words in my mouth if something gamechanging is included there, sorry in advance) all maemo community did was asking/hoping/begging a company, corporate entity that is not interested in moral ideas of freedom/opensource. What we lacked was monetary argument (any corpo argument really). Negotiations with Nokia if we proposed to them: instead of killing maemo/harmattan offer a price for that team, work, code, we will raise funds; instead of: pls Nokia you said you love FOSS, why you not releasing??? (insert angry rant when no reply is given) - would be much more frutiful (hopefully of course). We need negotiators as speakers for the community, not people endorsing this or other community project. This community deserves better future. And understanding what is needed to achieve the goal (open source Fremantle/Harmattan in my opinion is THE goal), not sending email reminders/followups to people who ignore you every two weeks to put an X on todo list next to 'Try to open source maemo'
ah. I'm not agreeing but now I understood what you're after.

Actually there was an effort to do an open version of maemo some years ago here. You even might have heard of the project "Mer". Of course Mer does something different nowadays but anyway
 

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misterc is offline misterc
2012-04-21 , 09:54
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#259
i know my posts are way too long for an average forum (social site ) reader to bother with
still i would expect a Council election thread to break the 1 liner rule

one liner (overly simplified)
Maemo's fate lies with NOKIA; NOKIA dies, Maemo dies; NOKIA survives, so does Maemo.

short enough?
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szopin is offline szopin
2012-04-21 , 09:55
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#260
Originally Posted by timoph View Post
ah. I'm not agreeing but now I understood what you're after.

Actually there was an effort to do an open version of maemo some years ago here. You even might have heard of the project "Mer". Of course Mer does something different nowadays but anyway
Yeah, in the middle of the logs, but that discussion is hardly relevant. Sure would be cool to have autobuilder for all maemo devices, but considering how Diablo now is almost forgotten... Fremantle needs another 'e' or it will wither like diablo. For council, I'd rather see either trying to achieve the free state, or coming up with possible solutions, or starting new threads for solutions ideas once all they came up with failed. Pro-active approach, not endless emails to contact@nokia.com just to write in the report: we did our best, sent 365 emails in this year for maemo-open-sourcing(366 as it's a leap year).
 

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