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Kangal is offline Kangal
2012-06-20 , 07:39
Posts: 1,789 | Thanked: 1,699 times | Joined on Mar 2010
#21
When WinRT tablets hit the market, I will officially declare it the Post-PC era.
iPad =/= PC, more like dumb-C.

The most frustrating part is that Linux could've been the Post-PC driver.
I mean imagine an ICS-style OS but with full-fledged Linux and a robust development framework.

More specifically, MeeGo!
Here's how it should've been planned:
- 5,000 top Apps from iOS and Android from the get-go
- EPIC 4G specced model smartphones in 2010
- Amazin Fire specced tablet in 2011
- Major update in 2011/2012 to incorporate some Linux apps, major push for MeeGo as top linux distro, improvements across the board, sponsor by SmarTVs and appliances
- Competitive features against Win8; only cheaper, more widespread, more apps before end-of-2012 (eg Current state of Android).
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Originally Posted by mscion View Post
I vote that Kangal replace Elop!
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Snak3 is offline Snak3
2012-06-20 , 08:19
Posts: 35 | Thanked: 10 times | Joined on Jul 2010
#22
Originally Posted by mikecomputing View Post
I want a 5" maemo harmattan tablet not a ****ing w8 crap 10" tablet. elop will FAIL
No offense but if what 'we' wanted was what the rest of the world realyl wanted... Everything would be linux and n900 / n9's would rule the world. We're a niche group. The world trusts Windows. Not on phones yet, Phones = Android. But tell someone to choose between android and Windows they'll want what they have on their PC.
 
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Dave999 is offline Dave999
2012-06-20 , 10:03
Posts: 7,074 | Thanked: 9,069 times | Joined on Oct 2009 @ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
#23
Originally Posted by MINKIN2 View Post
As long as the x86 tablet does not come with win8 pre-installed, I would be happy too.

Sadly MS are playing there "trump card" with the UEFI secure boot to prevent any malware (ie linux, bsd, WINDOWS pre7 or anyOS) from being installed on the device.

Heck, even removing that bloody OS and all traces of its damn bootloader from my win7 dualboot resulted in a full format of my HDD :\
Of cource it will come pre-installed. what is UEFI? no problem to duel boot on a pc so why should it here? something new in the windows 8 from the evil empire?

when you have formated the disk you should be happy and windows is gone you will live happy ever after.
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AB3S is offline AB3S
2012-06-20 , 10:18
Posts: 10 | Thanked: 4 times | Joined on Apr 2012 @ Milan, IT
#24
Originally Posted by Dave999 View Post
Of cource it will come pre-installed. what is UEFI? no problem to duel boot on a pc so why should it here?
The Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a specification that defines a software interface between an operating system and platform firmware. UEFI is meant as a replacement for the BIOS firmware interface...
So UEFI may prevent unsigned operating systems from booting on the hardware and this can be the problem....
 
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Dave999 is offline Dave999
2012-06-20 , 10:31
Posts: 7,074 | Thanked: 9,069 times | Joined on Oct 2009 @ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
#25
Originally Posted by AB3S View Post
So UEFI may prevent unsigned operating systems from booting on the hardware and this can be the problem....
If I get that **** in my tablet I will go bananas!

But I still not think this will prevent other OSes. Everything added to a disk must be possible to remove somehow. And wht about if you buying a windows 8 CD, where will this install itself? It cant lock down the HW from future changes to another OS.

Initially I have no problem have windows left at a small patition as possible.
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Last edited by Dave999; 2012-06-20 at 10:53.
 
Rebski is offline Rebski
2012-06-20 , 11:10
Posts: 874 | Thanked: 316 times | Joined on Jun 2007 @ London UK
#26
i think the question posed for the Thread is an excellent one. Microsoft has said that it has taken it's lead from Apple in controlling both the hardware and the software.

So where does that leave Microsoft's Partners, HP and the like? Out in the cold presumably. Certainly the cost of $85 for the OS puts them at a cost disadvantage immediately.

How will these companies, who previously relied on Windows for their business plans, now fare? What will they do to fight back to safeguard their companies' futures.

Perhaps form a consortium to develop their own OS?

Or am I being overly dramatic here?
 

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don_falcone is offline don_falcone
2012-06-20 , 11:35
Posts: 1,523 | Thanked: 1,997 times | Joined on Jul 2011 @ not your mom's FOSS basement
#27
Originally Posted by Dave999 View Post
what is UEFI? no problem to duel boot on a pc so why should it here? something new in the windows 8 from the evil empire?
Are you kidding me? You are talking about dual boot'n'stuff but don't really know the environment talked about here? Where have you been living all the last years? UEFI doesn't strike a chord with you, not even when you talk about desktop machines ("PCs")?

Go, read a bit.... trololololololololollololooolll!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified...ware_Interface
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-sourc...d-fedora/11187
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/...fi-secure-boot
http://digitizor.com/2012/06/01/fedora-uefi-microsoft/
http://linux.slashdot.org/story/12/0...-boot-solution
http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/12368.html
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...with-uefi.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr.../gg463149.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr.../hh973604.aspx
 

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Dave999's Avatar
Dave999 is offline Dave999
2012-06-20 , 11:45
Posts: 7,074 | Thanked: 9,069 times | Joined on Oct 2009 @ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
#28
Originally Posted by don_falcone View Post
Are you kidding me? You are talking about dual boot'n'stuff but don't really know the environment talked about here? Where have you been living all the last years? UEFI doesn't strike a chord with you, not even when you talk about desktop machines ("PCs")?

Go, read a bit.... trololololololololollololooolll!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified...ware_Interface
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-sourc...d-fedora/11187
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/...fi-secure-boot
http://digitizor.com/2012/06/01/fedora-uefi-microsoft/
http://linux.slashdot.org/story/12/0...-boot-solution
http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/12368.html
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...with-uefi.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr.../gg463149.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr.../hh973604.aspx
@donKEY_falconeNG

I have never said I'm an expert! I can do lot a **** with a computer but I dont understand everything. That is the great thing with it.

But If you are so great, please explain to me if I can dual boot a linux OS along with windows on Surface Pro. Or even better remove it and add another OS of my choice?

And Thanks for the links.

By the way, What is your opinion on the thread headline question?
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Last edited by Dave999; 2012-06-20 at 11:47.
 

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Snak3 is offline Snak3
2012-06-20 , 11:52
Posts: 35 | Thanked: 10 times | Joined on Jul 2010
#29
Originally Posted by Rebski View Post
i think the question posed for the Thread is an excellent one. Microsoft has said that it has taken it's lead from Apple in controlling both the hardware and the software.

So where does that leave Microsoft's Partners, HP and the like? Out in the cold presumably. Certainly the cost of $85 for the OS puts them at a cost disadvantage immediately.

How will these companies, who previously relied on Windows for their business plans, now fare? What will they do to fight back to safeguard their companies' futures.

Perhaps form a consortium to develop their own OS?

Or am I being overly dramatic here?
Its like the Google Nexus. I think the aim is not to take over the market with hardware (yet) but more to steal the market from apple with something bold.
Microsoft's first tablet will get alot of media attention. More so than a 3rd party Acer or HP tablet would. Get people to shift away from apple to a similar brand making the hardware and software.
Microsoft vs Apple is a better battle than HP/Acer/Toshiba vs Apple. Once people shift there thinking away from apple to Windows they'll want options anyway. The problem is apple is a single hardware/software powerhouse that needs to be taken down a notch and Microsoft is finally ready to stand up to them on a hardware basis, just like they did with the xbox 360 and Playstation 3.
 

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don_falcone is offline don_falcone
2012-06-20 , 12:29
Posts: 1,523 | Thanked: 1,997 times | Joined on Jul 2011 @ not your mom's FOSS basement
#30
Originally Posted by Dave999
I have never said I'm an expert! I can do lot a **** with a computer but I dont understand everything. That is the great thing with it.
"A lot of sh1t" doesn't mean anything or everything. I can do a lot of sh1t either, f.e. throwing keyboards out of a window, or use pencils to perforate, err, point on things on-screen on flat displays.

Originally Posted by Dave999
But If you are so great, please explain to me if I can dual boot a linux OS along with windows on Surface Pro. Or even better remove it and add another OS of my choice?
As probably nobody "in the public" has access to (both) Surface(s) yet, time will tell. Obviously, it was determined that WinRT (i.e. ARM-based) tablets / devices will definitely be SecureBoot-enabled; whereas x86-based ones shall be modifiable - still enabled, but the lock can be switched off as it seems:

"Hardware makers who choose the optional Microsoft Certification will be required to implement UEFI. Microsoft will also require that manufacturers offer the ability to turn off the secure boot feature on x86 hardware, but they must not offer such an option on ARM hardware. No mandate is made regarding the installation of third-party certificates that would enable running alternate software."

Note that the Surface Pro integrates an i5 processor. With high probability, you can install GRUB or whatever; and using unetbootin to fill the integrated flash with bits resembling an alternate OS.

EDIT:: i don't know if GRUB etc. will be recognized as "verified OS loaders", and if platform keys will be used by different OSes. Refer to the ZDnet articles.

Originally Posted by Dave999
By the way, What is your opinion on the thread headline question?
It surely will. But it is a question if the degree of change may be noticeable, or not. :P
Last edited by don_falcone; 2012-06-20 at 12:55.
 

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