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2008-01-07
, 20:22
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Posts: 139 |
Thanked: 24 times |
Joined on Sep 2005
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#42
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Originally Posted by Nutz
Many people did not buy the device to learn linux. They bought a device that should work -- and frankly I agree that software in Extras should Just Work (or at least install cleanly!).
Ignorance is not bliss when it comes to learning linux ! As is self evident by the most simple of things your haveing problems with. (dep's) Iam supprised that you even figured out how to switch it on.
Btw, attacking the person doesn't really improve the level of this conversation.
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2008-01-07
, 20:22
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Posts: 469 |
Thanked: 88 times |
Joined on Sep 2007
@ Montana
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#43
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Originally Posted by DJames1
Poof..
..... Would it possible to write a repository indexer that could cycle through all of them and create a database of what's where and what the dependencies of each package are?
...
http://www.gronmayer.com/it/
Although dependencies would take additional work.
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2008-01-07
, 21:09
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Posts: 87 |
Thanked: 6 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
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#44
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Originally Posted by Bod
Linux isnt Windows, so stop moaning and whining about how you just dont get it. Either get with the program and learn the basics of linux and stop "expecting" everything to work the way your use to, and everyone to wipe your *** along every step of the way.
Just because your cant be arsed or bother trying to figure it all out.
dos'nt give you any right to come onto forums like this *****ing and moaning at the very people who spend a lot of time bringing you the free apps and software you use.
If your not willing to learn how it works, or what you need to make it work, or even want to find out howto, you dont deserve to have a N8*0.
We don't see eye to eye, and I have a feeling the sentiment extends out to many other users here. Good for you, the IT works and makes you happy. Good for you, so smart and arrogant that you don't need any help- yet you don't offer help to others. Keep it to yourself, it makes you feel better: like hoarding all the food at the Ching-Pao buffet. Personally I don't care. I've had to figure out 95% of the problems for myself. I didn't even ask because of the reactions I'd get from your ilk. And in the end, the SD card slots are defective in mine, so it will be returned like so many other IT products to Nokia so the QC department can try to reverse engineer the problems with HARDWARE issues.
Oh yeah, then there's the laudry list of SOFTWARE issues that they also need to iron out. Whining? I have a feeling you are more upset that there are people in here giving Nokia a piece of their mind for producing what they see as defective/incomplete products. And that's exactly what I've done in another thread. Nokia apparently has read my post from last night. Who knows if they will do anything about it, but here's hope that they may. And this from an IT newb.
And besides, your notion to "quit whining" is akin to the Kremlin bashing in your door and arresting you for your opinion on government. The freedom of the Internet is not just for your cronies, and this forum is not private. If people don't stand up and make themselves heard, then the product will go nowhere while some other company makes millions and pushes the IT out of the market. So when some of this bull shi7 whining by a blasted newb actually gets Nokia's attention and something is done about it, where does that leave you, almighty Senior Member Man?
Oh that's right. You'll still be in the same selfish, hopeless state you were in all your life. (Edit: just looked again, this guy isn't even a senior member, he's only a wannabe.)
(Note to self: I hope he gives me something really juicy to work with. I've been wanting to use some reference to sewer and septic technicians lately.)
PS. What is this crapola about people "deserving" to own an IT? Since when do you need a degree in proctology to take a dump?
__________________
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zeusenergy is:
*A Four-time World Champion of Flame Wars
*A Professor of Truth at the Academy for the Advancement of (insert subject here)
*A Pathological Non-Liar
*A Dissector of Logical Thought
*A Cynical Comic of Society
Delusions of grandeur not included. Do not use product in a manner not specified by the Terms of Use. Avoid prolonged exposure to intellectually flawed thought for best results.
__________________________________
zeusenergy is:
*A Four-time World Champion of Flame Wars
*A Professor of Truth at the Academy for the Advancement of (insert subject here)
*A Pathological Non-Liar
*A Dissector of Logical Thought
*A Cynical Comic of Society
Delusions of grandeur not included. Do not use product in a manner not specified by the Terms of Use. Avoid prolonged exposure to intellectually flawed thought for best results.
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2008-01-07
, 21:42
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Posts: 10 |
Thanked: 0 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
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#46
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@ Bod,
Thanks for your VERY INTELLIGENT response to noob concerns on this tread.
Your response shows why the nokia N8x0 will NEVER be mass market product.
Some of us newbies come from OS environments where things just work (e,g MAC OS X). The main attraction of the Nokia N8x0 is it's advertised openness...But, Openness means nothing to the average Joe if you can't install programs without having to Learn how to use xterm etc.
Why do you think the iphone is popular? It's because nothing can beat on user interraction/usability.
I am perfectly entitled to whine when the Nokia N8x0 experience is not up to standard. I gained this right when i put down the money on purchase.
Oh, and thanks for recommending Linux for Dummies. Might come in handy to anyone who dare critisise Nokia on this Forum.
Thanks for your VERY INTELLIGENT response to noob concerns on this tread.
Your response shows why the nokia N8x0 will NEVER be mass market product.
Some of us newbies come from OS environments where things just work (e,g MAC OS X). The main attraction of the Nokia N8x0 is it's advertised openness...But, Openness means nothing to the average Joe if you can't install programs without having to Learn how to use xterm etc.
Why do you think the iphone is popular? It's because nothing can beat on user interraction/usability.
I am perfectly entitled to whine when the Nokia N8x0 experience is not up to standard. I gained this right when i put down the money on purchase.
Oh, and thanks for recommending Linux for Dummies. Might come in handy to anyone who dare critisise Nokia on this Forum.
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2008-01-07
, 22:11
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Posts: 7 |
Thanked: 1 time |
Joined on Jan 2008
@ UK
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#47
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Originally Posted by zeusenergy
Well there you go, my point egzatly! and now you "know" and you know because you got bothered to learn and ask question and seek help. And why? Because you had forsight to know the reactions you would get.
I've had to figure out 95% of the problems for myself. I didn't even ask because of the reactions I'd get from your ilk.
Originally Posted by zeusenergy
I cant speak for other peoples hardware issues. But what I do know is i have an IT that hasnt given me one problem in 9 months that I couldnt figure out without moaning about it. I agree that every now and again the odd IT here and there is defective and should be returned for replacement or refund.
I have a feeling you are more upset that there are people in here giving Nokia a piece of their mind for producing what they see as defective/incomplete products.
But that dont subtract from my point that most of the moaning is in regard to users not understanding the basics. And Nokia isnt selling you a crash course in linux, there selling you an IT !
Originally Posted by zeusenergy
I agree, But I,am not talking about the product, Iam talking about user expectations. In that "some" users "expect" more from the IT than they put in. Some want it to whistle and dance out of the box but as you have noted above, there is a basic understanding of the OS that "needs" to be grasped before such things happen.
If people don't stand up and make themselves heard, then the product will go nowhere while some other company makes millions and pushes the IT out of the market.
Originally Posted by zeusenergy
Hopefully it leaves me in the same place as you, with Nokia getting its finger out of its asz and fixing the issues only it can. But no matter what Nokia do, no matter what you or I do. The users who expect everything done for him/her will always expect it, if they cant be arsed to go figure it out and spend 20 mins on google before comeing and moaning about stuff that is fixed with the most basic of linux knowlege.
So when some of this bull shi7 whining by a blasted newb actually gets Nokia's attention and something is done about it, where does that leave you.
(snip) Sorry Iam not comng down to the sewer with you.
Bod
__________________
"When the bell rings. You better come out fighting. Because I sure will ! "
"When the bell rings. You better come out fighting. Because I sure will ! "
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2008-01-07
, 22:37
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Posts: 18 |
Thanked: 1 time |
Joined on Dec 2007
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#48
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Originally Posted by Bod
Why not? You're already under a bridge.
(snip) Sorry Iam not comng down to the sewer with you.
Bod
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2008-01-07
, 23:05
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Posts: 39 |
Thanked: 21 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
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#49
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IMHO the tablets out the box does just what there advertised to do. Most problems come about from people when trying to install 3-party software. Take Canola for example, it's not a Nokia product. So like I said out box the thing works great and I think to blame the tablets for the problems you having is a little unfair if it's 3-party software your installing.
Now as far as the 3-party stuff understand most all of it free, and anybody who has spent time with Linux knows there's still a price to pay with freeware. That price is the time and dependence hell. Linux is based on an open community and anybody with programming skills can look deep into it and tweak and change it, unlike windows. Because of this people have done just that, making many different version of Linux. This is both a good and bad thing. One good thing is it can chopped up into a pretty small OS and made to run on something like the N800. The bad thing is once you do this other Linux software might not run because the computer code needed to make the programs run is now missing (libraries/dependences). This is why when installing Linux software you end up looking for dependence files.
Another problem is sometimes people might write a librariy of code do a function, and other devoplers might use someone else libraries instead of rewritting them, then instruct you to install the other person libraries before installing there software. Yet another why you might have to look for dependence.
So, yea dependences can be pain in the A--, but over all concept of Open OS is still pretty cool, and think Nokia made a fine choice going this route.
Now as far as the 3-party stuff understand most all of it free, and anybody who has spent time with Linux knows there's still a price to pay with freeware. That price is the time and dependence hell. Linux is based on an open community and anybody with programming skills can look deep into it and tweak and change it, unlike windows. Because of this people have done just that, making many different version of Linux. This is both a good and bad thing. One good thing is it can chopped up into a pretty small OS and made to run on something like the N800. The bad thing is once you do this other Linux software might not run because the computer code needed to make the programs run is now missing (libraries/dependences). This is why when installing Linux software you end up looking for dependence files.
Another problem is sometimes people might write a librariy of code do a function, and other devoplers might use someone else libraries instead of rewritting them, then instruct you to install the other person libraries before installing there software. Yet another why you might have to look for dependence.
So, yea dependences can be pain in the A--, but over all concept of Open OS is still pretty cool, and think Nokia made a fine choice going this route.
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2008-01-07
, 23:06
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Posts: 7 |
Thanked: 1 time |
Joined on Jan 2008
@ UK
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#50
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Originally Posted by KAYZAI
Dont mention it.
@ Bod,
Thanks for your VERY INTELLIGENT response to noob concerns on this tread.
Originally Posted by KAYZAI
Then the problems you are having "must" be related to what your doing to your IT. because in nine months I have had no problems installing any app on my IT. I have used it every day since i got hold of it.
Some of us newbies come from OS environments where things just work (e,g MAC OS X). The main attraction of the Nokia N8x0 is it's advertised openness...But, Openness means nothing to the average Joe if you can't install programs without having to Learn how to use xterm etc.
Originally Posted by KAYZAI
Thats a matter of personal opinion. In my opinion there are a lot of sheep who just buy this years must have item, year in year out. The problem with the iphone is that the interaction and useability are defined by apple and Not the user. and thats where Nokia becomes much better item. In fact it becoms a tool that can be defined to do almost any task one cares to get it to do. Because the interaction and usability are defined by its users.
Why do you think the iphone is popular? It's because nothing can beat on user interraction/usability.
Originally Posted by KAYZAI
Yes you do, but thats not what my orignal post was about most of the "problems" people are having is when they move away from Nokias bundled apps and venture into the world of homebrew and 3rd party apps and getting them to work, and in general when users do this a small amount of knowlage is needed. Nokia warns you every time you try and install a 3rd party app that its at your own risk and if a user break it because they dont understand that (deps) are needed and that some bit you have to get from one place and other bits from else where, which is in fact a very basic understanding. then just like the warning says you gota fix it if you break it. and if you dont know how to fix it then dont moan about your inability to.
I am perfectly entitled to whine when the Nokia N8x0 experience is not up to standard. I gained this right when i put down the money on purchase.
Because when the screen says "are you sure you want to do this" you have to say YES ! and if you say yes then thats your beef not Nokias.
Originally Posted by KAYZAI
Look iam all for pointing the finger at Nokia if in fact it is something that Nokia is or has done. But if its the total incompetance and ignorance of the user, Iam all for pointing the finger in that direction too.
Oh, and thanks for recommending Linux for Dummies. Might come in handy to anyone who dare critisise Nokia on this Forum.
Just like when all the little hackers bricked there iphons for messing with stuff they dont understand and had been warned before not to.
At some point or other the user has to take the guff for being just out right stupid and breaking **** they dont understand.
Like the saying goes..."A little knowladge is far more dangerious than a whole library."
Bod
__________________
"When the bell rings. You better come out fighting. Because I sure will ! "
"When the bell rings. You better come out fighting. Because I sure will ! "
Why does app-get work sometimes when the repository install doesn't?