And, don't forget that INdT has already begun testing some cool "new" Canola features within a Qt framework:

http://blog.eduardofleury.com/archives/2009/04/69/

Tim

I cannot say Symbian is a bad OS as a whole. But if you loose applications and paid applications, this matters to anybody. If the AppManager stops working this matters. Because you cannot configure applications or delete some applications and this is not ok.

Summarizing, what are the problems with Symbian right now:

1. Erasing user applications (during update) - this is happening even if you backup personal data!

2. Erasing user data (during update), with no automatic backup. If Nokia knows the update will erase user data, it can have a little good manners to automatically backup that first, because the process is driven by the computer with Nokia Updater software.

3. AppManager is reportedly stopping working after more installations of applications.
__ * AppManager should not stop working (yes, some installs or uninstalls it is acceptable to fail, but not the manager itself).
__ * Even if the installation fails or it is interrupted, the AppManager should continue to work after that.

4. Even with the latest OTA (update Over The Air) and UDR (user Data Retention) on latest Symbian 3.2 and 5.x, applications will be deleted during update and the re-installed after update. Why this process of deleting applications and re-installing after update? This does not happen in Windows when upgrading to a new SP, and does not happen for iPhone OS or Android. Is this related to the DRM and "Symbian signed" stuff? Some applications survive this process of re-installing, some don't. The bigger problem is some paid applications don't survive.

5. If Nokia doesn't fix this issue with the OS update and broken app re-installation process and doesn't let you re-download a paid app, here is a problem.

6. Ovi store does not let you re-install (or re-download) the paid app even on the same device (AppStore lets you install on 5 devices, the same Android store).

7. Why from time to time the app icons are re-arranged by the system? I put them in different folders and they re-appear in Application folder. Or they appear in other order after some new installations. Or if you install Java 2.0 on s60 v5 the app icons are moved to the application folder from their folders? It seems there is a buggy desktop interface and AppManager. A normal OS these days is not that crappy and buggy in the up-front interface - the app icons desktop.


Now these are the problems with Symbian. Some of them and most of them don't apply to Maemo, but heads up. Because these issues are very inconvenient to the user. So Nokia has to stop complaining most of the Symbain users don't know application can be installed on the phone, or the majority of Symbian phones never installed an application on their phone. Maybe some ringtones, and that's it, no apps. This is normal the users to not use apps, because Symbian is not that ready to handle user applications, from all the above, with its crappy and buggy AppManager which stops working if you install a number of apps or if an install fails.

You're holding your breath for the perfect device OS... right?

Quick, let go of your breath I plead. You will simply die of the waiting !

Not professional , not a troll, this is a true experience I had with Symbian, yes it is a rant, yes Symbian is a good multi-tasking OS and has its qualities and maybe the classification made by me "Symbian is a big pain" is not fair from other points of view or for other features it has, but for me, at that time, Symbian was very frustrating with its inability to do a nice upgrade without deleting applications installed. Loosing paid applications is not an experience I want for you or anybody. If you are ok with this, that's your way. For me it is totally unfair.

Now, do you have a Symbian device? If yes, ever did a firmware upgrade?

Texrat, before accusing other people, maybe it is fair first to discuss on the thread subject and share your experiences. Or are you a troll?

Maemo is the only thing that will make Nokia to be one of the players in the smartphone market, because Symbian has some drawbacks, some problems with AppManager, app compatibility and OS firmware upgrade issues.
After the Nokia's flagship device N97, launched last month with mixed impressions, Nokia is under a lot of pressure and under the magnifying glass. Everybody expected more from Nokia flagship device. However, mostly the software part of N97 was not top of the line for usability and stability and diversity (number of app titles are not many on Symbian s60v5).
Nokia has now a second chance with N900 Maemo based, in October 2009, to put it right. To compete with iPhone OSX, Android, WinMo, RIM, Palm WebOS, and this will not be a simple job, but the expectation from users is have it right or swithch to other OS (like Android).
As in real life, this second chance with N900, after the semi-failure of the flagship N97, might be the last chance for many users to stay with or embrace Nokia.
This is why Nokia should learn from Symbian issues with compatibility of apps between devices and OS versions, for Symbian issues with the firmware installation process and the stability of AppManager.
Will be Maemo 5 when launched with N900 at the same level as Palm WebOS (based on Linux) or Android (based on Linux) and will overcome the issues in Symbian? Should Nokia try a device with Android, just to see how this OS fits its products diversification, or Maemo is same or even superior compared with Android?

The latest version for N95 8GB (N95-4 NAM) is v20.2.005
If it (NSU) isn't letting you upgrade to this firmware version then you can do this trick of changing the product code by downloading NSS and manually entering in a new product code.

To the guy that started this thread:
You might want to stick to Nokias latest version of PC Suite instead of the recent OVI suite.

Go to howardforums.com and talk to everyone else that owns N95 8GB's there about your N95 8GB
You will get the best info there. Nokia is known for neglecting their Nam N and E series firmware updates as their priority seems to have been euro firmware updates up until now.
The game is changing now however with the Symbian foundation taking over the OS.
Nokia's each move is getting compared to the other manufacturer's moves and Nokia has dropped the Japan market and moved to the US market.
So .... I don't think you are going to get much more than 1 or 2 firmware updates on that N95-4 from this point on.
Any improvements beyond that are going to be hacks or something downloadable from ovi store.
Make sure you always check at symbian-freak.com to see if there is a firmware update and also read the discussions for the articles that interest you.

Nokia needs to have the OS update over-the-air (OTA) done right for Symbian and Maemo. This is essential.
Look at Windows - if there is a security threat or a major update the UPDATE IS PUSHED to the users, does not matter if they are simple or non experienced users or tech savvy: a message box is presented saying in 10 minutes the OS will restart to upgrade and you can postpone this, but the update will be done for sure sooner or later.

Why the update pushed to the users by the OS by automatically downloading the package and automatic upgrade is important?

Because this way all the devices will have the latest OS version, no more trouble to develop apps and support older OS versions, and the customers will receive the latest patches so the user experience will improve. For instance, let's say the next symbian v5 firmware will have user UI goodies like kinetic scroll in lists, animations in UI when an application launches, and this will be applied to all v5 devices automatically, smooth, with no issues like loosing installed applications, then the customers will be happy and love Nokia and trust Nokia as an up-to-date OS promoter. This will build a huge confidence among customers that wake up the next day, see a message saying an update is available, they press yes and after a system restart they have an up-to-date OS. Is this possible for Maemo, if for Symbian is not possible because of secret device APIs?

The issue with this auto update is that some people prefer older versions of OS for running software they have as updates can break currently working software. Also, IT departments often come up with custom fixes for known bugs before official bug fixes. For this reason you want users to have a degree of control over whether and when they install updates.

Application upgrades (and minor OS patches known as SSU) are already 'pushed' this way (that's what the flashing ! tells you). As for complete OS upgrades, that's a different matter (but windows doesn't do that either). The integration between apps and the OS is much stronger on NITs, than on, say Symbian so it's more likely to botch something for (especially) advanced users (think application dependencies, boot menus, custom kbd layouts, etc), that's why a lot of folks think it's not a good idea to do fully automatically/forcefully.